Montreal Screwjob Discussion

[D]

I think Bret is one of these guys that forgot where he and his character ended.

Bret really thought it would hurt his career losing in Canada................ I never got his logic.

I agree 100 percent with what McMahon did to Bret.

In wrestling, it is all about doing the right thing for the business and Bret didn't. If Bret goes to WCW with the WWE title, WWE are finished and Vince wasn't gonna let that happen

I thought Bret acted like a spoiled baby TBH. he should've done the job but not clean and then parted ways. No one would've thought less of him.

[Gnrfan]

I agree 100 percent with what McMahon did to Bret.

So you think its ok to lie to someone who has helped your company become susessful for over 10 years? Its like your boss telling you you're in for a promotion only to find out not only you didn't get promoted you don't have your old job either. You'll never convince me or people within the wrestling business that Vince, Hebner & HBK were out of Order. You don't get wrestling if you agree with what happened that night.

Its a business of Honour and HBK, Hebner and Vince showed none. All the biggest people in wrestling were ashamed to be around when that happened. I remember Undertaker went home and told Vince not to call him and he'd be back when he was ready.

Mate it was a disgrace. Bret wouldn't of taken the title to WCW, he didn't wanna leave WWF in the first place... they wanted rid of him. To me honesty and honour are word used in Wrestling sometime loosely.... Bret had both, guys like Taker & Foley have it.... Vince doesn't, Hebner didn't..... i can maybe let HBK off a little but still he'll never shake that and when he dies... i won't remember HBK vs Taker @ Mania this year... i'll remember that he'll never be the greatest amongst his peers because he doesn't have everyone's respect as a person (no doubt about perferomer). You can't blacklist Vince coz he's their Boss but the senior guys always know how disapointed everyone was with the 3 main guys.

I also remember HBK saying he knew nothing about it.......Lying prick. If you're gonna be a scum bag at least be enough of a man to admit it.

[BlowUpYourVideo]

I read a topic on another board (which I'm not a member of BTW ) which asked "Is Bret Hart overrated?" and I was surprised at the number of people who thought he was overrated and/or sympathised with Vince regarding SS 1997.


Also, this is on the Montreal Screwjob article on Wikipedia:

However, in 2009 Bret Hart stated in an interview with Sky Sports that he will forgive Shawn Michaels, if Shawn apologizes first, saying "For me I don't really have much issue with it anymore. If you asked me that up until probably about a year ago I'd have probably said something different. But I've cooled off a bit now. I don't want to carry it around anymore. If he wanted to apologize I would accept it. I'd move on but I wouldn't forget it." He also put over the Michaels-Undertaker match at WrestleMania XXV, saying he was proud of both men's efforts and that despite his personal feelings towards Michaels, he always had the utmost respect for his abilities.

Guess there's still a chance that he could show up on WWE TV in the future....

[AtariLegend]

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x31qbr_backstage-after-montreal-screwjob_people

Listen to what Shawn says and make up your own minds.

[Gnrfan]

Look Bret deserved better. He turned down WCW despite better money and at the time WCW was beating WWF week in week out. Vince agreed a 20 year contract with Bret then asked Bret to leave coz he couldn't afford his contract. Bret agreed as a favour to Vince so they agreed on a last 30 day creative contol clause for Bret where Bret got input into his matches for the last 30 days. Vince agreed that the Survivor series would end in DQ and he screwed Bret and it just showed how big a dickhead Vince is. After the match they have HBK on camera saying "I didn't know anything about it" what a C%*T!!!!!

I think Bret maybe got too concerned with his Legacy but after all he did for WWF, he deserved to go out on his terms. He wasn't gonna take the belt to WCW... He didn't even wanna go to WCW himself. Vince basically killed Bret's charecter and anyone who sympathises really knows nothing about wrestling. As Taker said "If you do that to Bret Hart, what would Vince do to the rest of them" Vince doesn't give a **** about any wrestler... use them and drop them. For someone who has such business forsight at times he really doesn't understand his own creation.

Wrestling is all about Honour and looking after the guys you're in the ring with.... Taker gets it, Austin gets it, Foley gets it, Bret gets it as well as numerous others. But people like HBK, HHH... they don't get it.

Some things that are for sure:

Vince is a liar.... FACT!

HBK is a liar.... FACT! I find it funny that he is a god lover these days.... coz there aint no angel waiting for that prick.

Hebner is a liar.... FACT!

HHH is scum bag! but Brets wife chewing him out is brilliant. HHH looked like he'd been sent to the principals office. Head down! **** ****!

Lets not forget Vince's business forethought when dealing with Owen harts death either. Owen asked for his Release following the "Screwjob" Vince denied him... Then he dies and Vince won't take responsibility for it.

Its things like this that makes me never wanna watch wrestling again.... giving money to him makes me sick.

[Hammy]

Always a tricky one, I know some people still think it was a work, the way those cameras for the documentary were always in the right place.

Bret has always been way to massive of a mark for himself, but it doesn't change what happened from being a shitty thing to do.

Obviously Vince is a paranoid guy and times were very tough.  He felt he'd been screwed by Alundra Blayze taking the title over and dumping it live on air, as well as guys like Luger, Savage, Hall and Nash jumping ship.

From Bret's point of view, he talked how they had a father-son relationship, so Bret obviously finds it insulting Vince would even consider Bret would screw the company.

I'm pretty sure on the HBK DVD I have Triple H actually says it was his idea.

Incidently, anyone who hasn't seen Wrestling With Shadows really needs to buy it 

[D]

I guess it was "Shitty" but I can't blame Vince for protecting his business either.

It's easy for us to sit here and say Vince should've done this or that but when its your company, your money and your livelihood on the line, U can't take any chances.

Shawn lied to protect himself in my opinion. He didn't want to lose the respect of the locker room.

I don't sympathize as much with wrestlers as some people. It is the job they chose.

[Hammy]

Maybe he lied to protect himself from getting beaten up by Bret (again).

Wouldn't surprise me if Vince was talked into doing it, to an extent, like I said it was Hunter's idea, maybe HBK were in Vince's ear making him paranoid and telling him Bret could screw him, I really need to re-watch my HBK DVD to see what exactly they said.

[Izzy]

The incident can be seen as the moment WWF won it's war with WCW. Bret was let go because WWF had no money, 1 year later WWF had won the Monday night wars

vince saved his company and made bret a legend, bret wasn't screwed - he was imortalised, and made alot of money from it all

it was a dishonest thing to do - but didn't hurt vince, the wwf or bret

[Gnrfan]

The incident can be seen as the moment WWF won it's war with WCW. Bret was let go because WWF had no money, 1 year later WWF had won the Monday night wars

vince saved his company and made bret a legend, bret wasn't screwed - he was imortalised, and made alot of money from it all

it was a dishonest thing to do - but didn't hurt vince, the wwf or bret

No the moment they won the Monday night wars was when Austin beat HBK and started his title reign as well as the "Attitide Era" IMO. And i think it had less to do with WWE and more to do with WCW blowing out their own brains.

I see no link between screwing Bret and Winning the Monday Night Wars. The only way WWF was better off with Bret leaving was finiancial becase once again Vince promised something he couldn't deliver on. And Bret could have said no screw you i'm staying and you can pay me.... But he didn't he did what was best for WWF out of respect for vince.

Bret was already a Legend and didn't get the send off he deserved for his years of Service. Maybe he got more column inches but it wasn't like this incident put Bret on the map.

And i disagree about not hurting Bret.... it did. It hurt his dad and all his Family. Owen wanted out coz of the incident and Vince refused (probally still be alive if Vince said yes). Bret said he never felt the same in a Wrestling arena after the incident. So to say that it didn't hurt anyone is BS really.

Maybe he lied to protect himself from getting beaten up by Bret (again).

Again? do tell! Never heard this.

I guess it was "Shitty" but I can't blame Vince for protecting his business either.

I can. Be a man! Tell Bret.... look you have been brilliant for me but i need you to lose the title before you go. Say drop it on RAW before montreal and the SS match will be the re-match... where HBK gets himself DQ'ed and everyone goes home happy. I don't buy into all this BS of "Vince had to do it for the business" thats crap... you can do what you want in life and he made a scummy, selfish and horrible decsion and didn't have the bollocks to tell someone who had made him millions.

Bret said he'd never go to WCW with the WWF belt and i'm pretty sure Bishoff even gave his word too... and Vince still screwed him and then made it into a angle to add insult to injury.

The business changed too much for Bret and it made him feel unconfortable. The bad guys like Austin started getting cheered and the really good guys like Bret were kinda left behind but to do it in that way can destroy a person and their family. But Vince carries on with no accountability.... **** him.

Shawn lied to protect himself in my opinion. He didn't want to lose the respect of the locker room.

Are you kidding? HBK is hated by many. Rock, Austin, Orton, Beniot, Hogan, Bret, Shamrock, Taker & even Foley have all made the same "He's so talented but......" comment over the years. I remember Booker T calling him a little girl after an argument over the Batista situation. He has respect for the quality of his work but very few respect him as a person.... Pretty much coz he's a selfish, lying prick (or at least was).

He is no more or less to blame than Vince. He was a star and he knew and then like the little **** he is, couldn't admit to it. He is a shitty person (or at least was) and has always been out for himself. The problem is that the guy is immesnly talented and thats why people put up with his ****.

People forget about Hebner too..... dick! Before the match he was telling Bret's wife he'd miss her and all that ****. But at least he admitted that he knew about it.

[Hammy]

Owen wanted out coz of the incident and Vince refused (probally still be alive if Vince said yes)

...And he might of been hit by a bus on his way out of Titan Towers, blame Vince for a lot of things but to even relate those 2 things....

The whole butterfly effect and all that, something like letting Owen leave could have lead to some weird wacky things happening maybe much worse 

Maybe he lied to protect himself from getting beaten up by Bret (again)

Again? do tell! Never heard this.

Well my memory is sketchy so rather than try to remember I used google search...

Bret and Shawn got into a real fight backstage, where Bret confronted Shawn about comments Shawn made about Bret Hart and Sunny. From what's being said, Bret took down Michaels and there was some hair pulling and then WWF officials had to break it up. Right after Shawn got his ass kicked I mean after the fight, Shawn went in Vince's office and demanded a contract release and Vince said no. They were both sent home that night.

Are you kidding? HBK is hated by many.

Don't forget Ron and Don Harris, they threatened to beaten him up on many an occasion!

[Gnrfan]

Owen wanted out coz of the incident and Vince refused (probally still be alive if Vince said yes)

...And he might of been hit by a bus on his way out of Titan Towers, blame Vince for a lot of things but to even relate those 2 things....

The whole butterfly effect and all that, something like letting Owen leave could have lead to some weird wacky things happening maybe much worse 

I'm not saying Vince killed him. I'm just sayin thats the kinda guy Vince is.... He screws his brother and Owen just doesn't want to be there and he asks to leave and he says No! Surely knowing you've just been a prick, Vince should have shown some respect for the mess he created.

Are you kidding? HBK is hated by many.

Don't forget Ron and Don Harris, they threatened to beaten him up on many an occasion!

Shame they didn't

[D]

U don't see a link? WHAT??

Screwing Bret made Vince hated and a villain which gave birth to the whole Mr McMahon character and his feud with Stone Cold which destroyed WCW.

Bret couldn't evolve with the times and got left behind. Bret's contract was up after SS, so yeah he gave his "word" but u can't take that chance,especially considering how down WWE were at the time.

Bret should've done what was right for business. Vince wanted him to lose and he refused to drop the title.Bret forgot it was just a show. He actually thought Canada would disown him if he lost or some bullshit like that.

Bret screwed Bret.

I don't blame Shawn for being a prick backstage. U have to remember, no small guy ever got the chance to be the MAN. so once Shawn got that what was he suppose to do? say "here dude, take my spot and put me back into the midcard"

He has a living to make as well, so I can't blame him for wanting to stay at the top, especially when he is the best on the roster.

[Izzy]

U don't see a link? WHAT??

Screwing Bret made Vince hated and a villain which gave birth to the whole Mr McMahon character and his feud with Stone Cold which destroyed WCW.

exactly the point i was trying to make

WCW was felled not by Austin, but by Austin vs McMahon - that was Attitude and the heel McMahon stemmed in no small part from this one event

We can thus see the screwjob as the turning point - Austin needed something extra, heel McMahon was just that...

WCW fell to bits because it was trying to hard to beat RAW...and RAW was winning because....

It all stems back here

[More Cowbell]

Montreal doesnt **** me off one way or another both men made great money in the business, Vince's treatment of Owen before and after his death thats something that pisses me off and I could rant on for a few hours.


My god is anyone else watching Raw right now, as I type Chavo is chasing Hornswoggle around like the crooks in the old home alone movies.